I use Thunderbird for e-mail on two devices. I wish to download mail on to each device, without deleting from the server, and to be able to manage the mail (delete etc) on each device without it affecting what appears on the other device. I also have a third machine which I use as a master which, when I download mail to Thunderbird on that, deletes what is on the server. I do not believe I can do this with IMAP but I can with POP3. So, my question is, can I download my *@murena.io mail to Thunderbird using POP3?
Thanks,
Mr. Jamme.
If you have more than one machine (this is almost everywhere the case) than it’s the best option not to request the POP3 server but to use the IMAP server instead. Whatever you try with POP3 on several machines … it ends by design in unsatisfying solutions, that’s my experience over the last 25 years.
Using an IMAP server allows equitable downloads from wherever you try it, synchronizing of the read-marks and long-term keeping messages on the server which reduces accessibility problems later on the clients. An IMAP server gives you additionally the opportunity to use push messages, so you don’t need to poll it again and again, the server informs your device(s) whenever a message is received.
Irrlicht,
Thank you for your response but my 25 years of experience tells me that IMAP gives an unsatisfactory response, especially to the situation I have outlined. The advantages you outline are of no use to me; I do not want things pushed for example and I do not want things left on a server. Now, do you know of any means of getting IMAP to do what I want?
Thanks,
Mr. Jamme.
As far as I could understand the constellation is that you have a mail server and several mail clients and you want to download mails to these clients (under conditions, doesn’t matter).
The access on a mail server by several clients is exactly what IMAP has been invented for.
Sure you can also do this also with a POP3 server but since POP3 has been developed for exactly one mail client using a rather straight forward move transportation of a message the access by a second mail client leads very soon to problems you must then handle. Your question is already an expression of these problems. Sure you can just use copies but you must handle this, and you must then never forget that today is Friday or whatever and you are here and not there and all this. This gets difficult. And when the day comes when something is a bit different (you are in vacation or on an upgrade training course or you get one additional device) the problems get bigger and stranger. And then people ask “Why can’t I just get my damned mails from here to there?” A typical answer is “Because you use a POP server.”
A big problem a POP server has is that there’s only one read flag per message. When the first client reads a new message the second client sees it has already been read. Many clients do not even download it anymore, it’s an old message. So you must handle the read flags every single time you access the POP server by a client. I tell you this is not something you want to do for longer than three days.
Irlicht,
In your third paragraph, I really do not understand what problems I may have. I have never had such problems with POP3 and other mail accounts in the past.
I’m sorry but your fourth paragraph is completely wrong. What you have described is what happens in IMAP in my experience, which is why I do not like it. With POP3, after mail has been downloaded, the user of the device can do whatever they want with it within Thunderbird and other users are not affected by this.
Now, again, do you know how to set up a Murena e-mail account to run POP3, or, to set up IMAP to work in the manner I’m looking for?
Thanks,
Mr. Jamme.
Sigh.
You will see.
To answer your questions:
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Sure, you can of course configure several Thunderbird clients to request the POP server of Murena, the address is the same, mail.ecloud.global, port is 995. Also Thunderbird suggests you to use the IMAP server on port 993 (because that’s the more intelligent and typical way) but you can decide to use indeed POP3.
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Then, when the Thunderbird account has been created, you should definitely check the option that mails remain on the server. It must be on. This is needed for your untypical use case that also other mail clients should be able to read mails from the same POP server.
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You have then the only chance to poll this POP server on an on in a configured interval. This principle causes a lot of network traffic (especially because you will normally have old messages in your Inbox) and also energy consumption on your devices.
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Whether other mail clients are indeed able to download mails which already have been downloaded by another mail client is questionable because the read flag on the server will probably be set by the first one, so the messages are not new anymore for other mail clients. This needs an experiment. Different mail clients do indeed behave different and some depend on this flag. Others pump the entire contents of the server’s Inbox again and again to the client and compare the messages with older informations they have to decide locally what’s new and what’s not, independent from the read flag. Can be that Thunderbird is able, don’t know. Note: the app which is called Thunderbird on Android is totally different from the Thunderbird on a PC. On Android it’s a K-9 fork like the stock Mail app.
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Deleting on the POP server is complicated. Normally deleting doesn’t even happen on a POP server because the mails are moved immediately to the client caused by the client request. The problem comes up when you decide to leave the mails on the server. I guess all clients are then equal, this means all can delete not only their own local copies but also what’s on the server. An experiment should show whether deletion on the server takes place.
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This affects even more actions: Drag & Drop, Cut & Paste, Thunderbird has also Archiving functionality … When a Thunderbird user decides to drag a message from his Inbox to one of his local folders it’s questionable how this affects the POP server. I guess the message is then moved from the server (and will then be lost for others), don’t know.
This all can be done, somehow. But to manage this consequently is additional expenditure and it’s also error-prone. And you notice it in many cases when it’s too late. Note: when a message is once local you will not get it onto any other place anymore, the POP server doesn’t allow a push back.
On an IMAP server it would be generally different. They main difference is: the mails remain typically on the server and that’s their only location. If you want a structured archive than you make it on the server and it’s accessible by all clients. The clients do not need local copies, they act only as viewers on the server’s contents, so there’s also no need to manage their access. When you indeed want to have local copies you can do that of course with your Thunderbird. You can then indeed push messages (and entire trees with thousands of messages) back to the server (even to another IMAP server) and download them somewhere else.
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Irrlicht,
I trust you feel better after your sigh: it’s hard being a genius in a world of fools.
I think your first point gives me the answer I wanted: simply set up Thunderbird the same as I would for IMAP but use Port 995 instead. If this is correct, then that is all I need and I don’t understand why you didn’t just tell me this.
You may turn out to be right but I’ll give it a go.
Many thanks for your time and concern.
Mr. Jamme.
Yes, and I can’t stop sighing …
Because you get a behavior you probably do not want to have, that’s it. I’ve seen people getting nuts with their multiple clients (everyone has multiple mail clients now) on their stone age POP servers and important mails disappearing here and there …
Note: It’s not only changing the port, especially not afterwards in case you have already an IMAP account. Instead you must decide what kind of server you want an account for and then create this account with the correct type. This is a question on the account setup dialog.
Sorry, I have only Betterbird available, this is a worth doing fork of Thunderbird and maybe some things look a bit different. In Betterbird the account setup dialog asks for name and email address and then shows this suggestion for an account to create:
When you click on the blue Weiter (“Forward”) it makes indeed an IMAP account. You must strictly intervene and use the link I circled red (“Change configuration”). There you can say, make me a POP account.
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@irrlicht that is high level forum support 
your sighing reminded me to do more breathwork: inhale(1 2 3 4)…exhale(1 2 3 4 5 6)… a-e-i-o-u-ommmm!
