Well … may be that’s the actual (really inconvenient) truth, but this is quite not the promise of e-OS, if we can discuss about what’s an important app … OK, this is not an app, but a feature : the GPS location => is it not an important feature ? and so, is it not a real issue if some unreplaceable apps stop working because they are relying (stupidly, I agree, but no replacement) on Ggle location layer rather than on standard AOSP location layer … and because microG is in this kind of bad period of time during which the location code has been broken for some reason and not yet fixed because it takes time and guys, and because they are not much and many ? and may be clumsy at times ?
It very much is, and it isn’t broken for everybody.
I wish I knew what the problem is on devices having trouble (apart from the HereWeGo App), but I don’t.
It’s working totally fine on my Fairphone 3 on 1.6-s-20221201239247-dev-FP3 (with OsmAnd, Magic Earth, GMaps WV, GPSTest and SatStat).
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Maybe this one:
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Yeah, also Settings - System - microG - Location modules - Mozilla Location Service seemed to be disabled for some users for unknown reasons and re-enabling it helped … but both of these things don’t seem to apply to the cases in which the HereWeGo App is the only one able to use the correct location (I edited my previous post to be more clear) … or I missed the connection, which is possible.
Anyway, off-topic.
You are right, not broken for everyone, see this gitlab issue :
- since 1.2 (july 2022, after the location module of microG/GmsCore was heavily changed),
- at least S9, S9+, S10e and One,
- limited to some apps : at least Trackbook (FOSS), Sygic with “system” location mode (closed source), Naturalist (closed source, said to use FusedLocationProviderClient API),
- most other apps (like those you list) do work as expected (but do they use the Glglg API or the AOSP one ?)
Trackbook has many other possible replacements ; I don’t know for Sygic (but guess it has at least some, partly ?) ; as for Naturalist, no replacement for this semi-professional on-field animal data collection app feeding up biodiversity follow up databases : I’m stuck with no information about when someone will look at this (found no related issue on microG bug tracker) 
OK, I understand we are not enough numerous to be taken care of … that’s life and death.
I think it was already open source when gogol bought Android, that’s why they built their own proprietary infrastructure aside to android and implement links to it into android
(Gogol Services Framworks)
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I can certainly understand your frustration, so let’s just hope mentioning the issue in the context here will help in some way.
If you are talking about NaturaList by Biolovision Sàrl, this App is GSF-dependent (Google Services Framework) according to Aurora Store (which displays this info for Apps). In this case technically nobody can guarantee you that it will work on /e/OS at a certain point in time. That’s what I’m talking about.
True, simple advertising to get more potential users at the cost of dealing with eventual grievances afterwards. A choice was made.
In the end as they say you can’t have your cake and eat it. You can’t degoogle and expect to still have 100% Google. You can try to come close, though … and /e/OS is a very good try in that sense, chances are really high that most of the Google-dependent Apps will work just fine most of the time. But as you correctly point out, that’s not how they word it up front.
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That’s interesting. Can you provide link to the information about why Google did that? 
“Secret of the affairs” is practical when you project to enchain and spy your customers.
Open source is very efficient but not secret.
This is an enlightening read:
It is interesting (as well as being five years old 
).
For the apps mentioned where the original Android version was open but is now closed (Search, Music, Calendar, Keyboard), and for the apps mentioned as being “in the firing line” (Gallery, Messaging, maybe Hangouts - I don’t know what that is or what it does), there are now perfectly usable FOSS alternatives (including DuckDuckGo, Qwant etc, loads of music players, ETAR, Simple Calendar, AOSP Keyboard, QKSMS, Simple Gallery, Open Camera). All of them free and open, and available to be used in Custom ROMs that are also free and open.
Then there is a lot of stuff about locking in device manufacturers. That doesn’t affect custom ROM developers, and I don’t have a problem with Google doing what they can to make sure that they get a cut of
- whatever revenues companies like Samsung, Xiaomi, LG, Motorola, Sony etc. are making from selling products based on Google’s (open source) operating system
- whatever revenues app developers make from in-app payments or buying apps in the play store.
In short, if anyone is making money from using Google’s (open source), Google are taking a cut. I really don’t have a problem with that
There are also now open source implementations of many of Googles APIs - that’s what microG is all about.
The other way (not covered in that article) that Google make money is by using the data their apps collect (if you are signed in to your Google account, and if you allow that collection in your account settings) to sell targeted advertising to corporations who want to buy targeted advertising. Again I don’t have a problem with that: I have disallowed data collection in my Google account settings, I never look at online advertising, and I only use Google apps that work without me signing in to my account (mostly Google Maps).
So, I am quite happy that
- Google continue to make AOSP available for use in great custom ROMs like /e/OS, LineageOS etc. AND
- they make the money they need to do that by taking a slice of the revenues of other big corporations (which would happily charge the same or more for their devices even if they weren’t paying Google a percentage).
It would be easy enough for Google to do 2 with doing 1. It’s what Apple do, it’s what BlackBerry did. Nokia and Motorola and Sony Ericsson also made phones with open source OS’s (Symbian, Meego), but they didn’t find ways of making enough money to carry on making phones. Those manufacturers that still have viable mobile phone businesses, mostly do it by paying Google to use the proprietary bits of Android. Again, I don’t have a problem with that.
And the alternative is iOS
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And the situation is probably worse by now.
And most users of Android probably don’t know they even exist, or just obliviously continue to use Google’s version without a thought to their privacy.
Not everyone even has an account with Google, yet they are still tracked and used for advertising purposes without giving consent, on mobile and desktop. Fortunately there are tracker-blocking apps available, or browser extensions like NoScript and uBlockOrigin, as well as other methods implementable on computers or home networks, but again, not everyone is aware of them or cares about privacy.
We users of /e/OS generally care about privacy.
What if I don’t have a google account? they still collect MY data. In MIUI even if I don’t sign with google I still must agree with their collecting or else the installation stops. This is wrong, and I dream with a life without google and the like.
This what I what I have to say to them
In 4 words: “I don’t need your shit”
In 3 words: “give me alone”
In 2 words: “No way”
In 1 word: “FU”
Better IMHO - lots more FOSS solutions: apps APIs, custom ROMs
Not - in any personally identifiable way - by Google I think. Am I wrong? Can you tell me how Google track individuals in any way beyond e.g. anonymous users of an i.p. address probably located in UK?
I do care about privacy. I just don’t happen to believe that Google are “evil” because they have found a way to make money from their open source software, while still allowing others to use it and, if they can find a way - as e.g. /e/OS and IodéOS (and Xiaomi - see my next comment) seem to be doing - to make money from it.
Then don’t use MIUI. That’s from Xiaomi and they’ve chosen to use Google’s proprietary parts. Use a FOSS custom ROM that only uses Google’s open source parts, and say what you have to say to Xiaomi
Was quite the popular messaging platform for awhile. Still have an old version installed on some old setups. Didn’t know 'til now the service completely ended last November.
Unrelated. Didn’t expect to see this warning from the search engine.
That’s funny.
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I don’t!
I’m now with Lineage A12 Gsi made by AndYan. I had to select a version with OEM Gapps (the only available with Google Play Services) and I had to install root to deactivate lots of useless google stuff, always persistently and aggressively warned that the system would have bad behavior and could even crash.
I’ll try to check the connections made to google and probably will have to radically uninstall that shit.
EVERY connection must be done with my agreement, with or without personal data.
There are people that don’t care or maybe like it, but not me.
In my opinion, it’s a logical fallacy to think that “anonymized” data is OK. See:
Consider Google’s access to/domination of:
- Web searches of most of the world’s internet users
- Data analytics integrated into the majority of web pages
- DNS queries of most of the world’s internet users
- Browser share
- Mobile phone platform share
- Location & Navigation for phones and many vehicles
- Video interests and sharing of and among most of the world’s internet users
- Detailed photography of a large part of the world’s streets and private residences
- Observation of multiple IP addresses per device user
- Mobile app tracking, on Android and even iOS
- Android OS system tracking, even on custom ROMs, even without the user creating a Google account
- Flight and travel searches
- Personal/private health-related queries on the internet
- Television viewing analysis from smart TVs/streaming devices
- Financial/banking site/app usage
- IoT data
- Website gatekeeping via reCAPTCHA
- Email, messaging, calendar entries, and contacts for a large segment of internet users
- Google Voice/GoogleFi users and contacts
- Shopping queries and purchases
- And so on
Personally, I wouldn’t want Google to have such data on me, even if they claim it’s anonymized. Just look how they’re being fined by governments and consumer protection agencies in the EU and beyond, while attempting to secure their ability to still collect data (FloC, Topics API, etc.)
Advertising revenue can be had without trying to target individual users; that’s how it used to be. (Not that any advertising likely has much effect on most internet users anyway.)
Finally:
(Apologies to @GaelDuval if we’re hijacking his thread a bit. )
IMPORTANT: I read the comments and mkst seem to watch for and alternative to both methods to vote for. This article explains how you wont be tracked by googles safety net, but you still can exess your banking accounts. I am not an expert in this matter, but could this be a SOLUTION?
Thanks.
I suppose you’re talking about “ih8sn” and build property “ro.debuggable” especially!?
If so, you might consider to deliver your “safetynet pass” modification for eOS versions Q and R as an optional eOS-recovery-flashable AddOn, just like the originators do ( https://github.com/luk1337/ih8sn/releases/tag/latest ). (Maybe accompanied by a hint that to switch back and forth between “safetynet” and “adb root debugging” can be accomplished by a slight modification of “/system/etc/ih8sn.conf” regarding the DEBUGGABLE option within it)
PS
With this solution only one problem will remain: How to handle devices for which no functional eOS recovery exists, as e. g. the Samsungs a3/5/7xelte, s5neolte, …?
Concerning especially these devices another try to contend with the problem reported within “Error message after clean Q install (#2840) · Issues · e / Backlog · GitLab” might help …
There are also the privacy aware users who
- want to have a reasonably safe smart phone (are better off without root)
- want to use their smartphone for every day purposes (including for instance push TAN apps for which there is no browser based alternative)
- don’t want unnecessary data transfers to Google AND
- don’t want (for whatever reasons) buy a new phone with “stable” /e/ releases and thus use “dev” releases even if they are no developers.
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