That was the version downloaded from F-Droid. The one in /e/ store works!
Iām happy with the removal of Telegram and Signal, we can install them through the store so no loss there. For DeltaChat, Iām happy to try it, I had never heard of it but why not.
After all, this is a beta, itās the best time to go crazy and try anything.
2 Likes
@GaelDuval What chat app do you use?
Do you approve of Riot?
Just looking for personal opinion here! Thanks
@donut3 and I just tried out Jami chat functionality (not yet voice or video calls.) In my opinion it works pretty well but the UI really needs some work. Fundamentally the developers need to understand the way Android apps normally respond to a back button click. It should close the sidebar, not close the app. That annoyance aside, Iād say it has great potential.
I agree with @Vaughan. I would say, for the desktop app, that the up-arrow key should edit the chat just sent and that there should be an option to edit sent chats. Still, I like this app Jami much better than Skype because of its privacy!
The more I think about @ricoās idea of using Nextcloud Talk as instant messager, the more I like it.
It fits right into /e/'s infrastructure, that is based on Nextcloud and allows a decentralized setup.
The downside is, that configuring the app is not very userfriendly in comparison to other instant messaging apps, which even notify you when people in your address book install the app and make connecting to your contacts easy. So this would not be strictly speaking an ideal solution for moms and dads.
Besides the already mentioned Riot/Matrix, Tox also looks promising, but I did not yet have the chance to try it out.
1 Like
Agreed. Itās pursuing the same idea as Jami. I looked at the Antox client for Android a few years ago. It was good but still very early in development. Perhaps I should look again.
I am a signal user.
I have nothing against leaving the choice to people, however, Iām just wondering why replace an application without trackers by another with a GPS tracker ?
https://reports.exodus-privacy.eu.org/en/reports/632/
https://reports.exodus-privacy.eu.org/en/reports/75275/
Itās not my vision of privacy.
1 Like
hmmmmm Tox does not seem to support automatic contacts adding based on your address book though, i wonder if thatās acceptable to an average user. It also doesnāt seem federated - imo federating is the future!
Good find. Very interesting.
Federation doesnāt matter if itās truly distributed. There are no servers to compromise. This is the strength of both Tox & Jami. I agree that this model does create ease of use difficulties which might be unacceptable to the average user.
As I have prordered a Librem 5 which will use matrix as default IM protocol, I have installed miniVector from F-Droid on my phone (and Riot on Debian) about 3 months ago to see how it works. Since then the handling of keys has improoved somewhat, but I still would not ask any member of my family to switch over from Threema. I feel Matrix is still too tricky to use.
What I personally do not like is to be forced to sign up on that vector.im identity server or any other. Threema does not require such a thing, why does Matrix? I want to decide myself if I want to be in the telephone book! At this point Matrix is lacking privacy awareness.
Matrix has the advantage over many other IMs to be independently usable on many OS apart from mobile devices. But this too is not yet fully developped. For Gnome there is Fractal recommendend as client app. But Fractal cannot handle E2E. So as a Gnome user one has to resort to Riot, which is an Electron app. And here creeps in Chromium, that is Google, and a quite uneasy feeling.
I think Matrix is very promising, but it is not there yet, especially so for mum and dad.
So cross-signed device verification is almost ready - see https://twitter.com/matrixdotorg/status/1138938399161798658 and https://twitter.com/matrixdotorg/status/1139231218535415809 for how it works.
In terms of the identity server: they are optional - if you donāt want to be in the telephone book, donāt specify a server! 
And even then, the phonebook is look-up only (i.e. mapping a known email address or phone number to a matrix ID).
Finally, Fractal can handle E2E using Pantalaimon (although the project is only a few weeks old).
Our aim is absolutely to get Riot & Matrix usable for the mums & dads of this world.
4 Likes
There is a new app in development, simplematrix, which has stalled for the moment and is off F-droid temporarily (hopefully), but that aims to make Matrix on Android as accessible as Telegram or Signal, with a similar user interface.
see https://gitlab.com/Nordgedanken/simplematrix
and
Join #SimpleMatrix:matrix.ffslfl.net using https://matrix.to/#/#SimpleMatrix:matrix.ffslfl.net (Markdown parser doesnāt like Matrix.to links somehow)
i didnāt know the identity server on Matrix is optional, but thatās cool!
Thank you @Matthew for pointing out the recent progress of Matrix. It is this ongoing development, that nourishes my hope, that it will be finally as easy to use as the those existing alternatives that have undesireable features one way or other.
As to that cross-signed device verification business, I think every user should be fully responsible for his devices himself. When I trust and verify a buddy, then it should be understood that this includes his devices without any further requirement for verifying at all. A need for double verification gives Matrix a disadvantage in usability.
Please let new registrants know during the process that an identity server is not compulsatory! And maybe you can the client comparison at https://matrix.org/docs/projects/clients-matrix get updated (features seem to be outdated and clients missing, e.g. Pattle).
Are there any news concerning bridges from the prevailing protocols? If Whatsapp or Telegram users securely could bridge into Matrix this would make Matrix a clear favorite as default in /e/ I think.
I wish you and your project all the best!
1 Like
Iād prefer to have no IM app preinstalled - also on iOS and Android most users install the IM app(s) their friends and family are using. Especially if itās currently difficult to make default apps uninstallable I see no good reason to install an IM app that most of the people canāt use because their contacts are not willing to change.
I like the suggestion already made to do it similar to the browser selection on Windows. Just let the user install the IM apps he wants directly after installing /e/.
I personally use Signal, Telegram, Whatsapp, Riot.im, Threema, and others, depending on what my contacts use.
Riot.im was a bit complicated from time to time when keys had to be requested again, more devices showed up in a chat than we actually possess. However, voice quality is really good.
I tried DeltaChat on iOS and there itās still in beta and buggy. Iād recommend not to preinstall an IM on /e/ that is not ready on all main platforms.
2 Likes
The Only english here ?
What is the purpose (the goal) of a universal system that wants to replace android ?
Admit multilanguage here and do not put people in boxes !
Nobody puts you in a box. But you are free to consider yourself in a (mental) box.
English is not my native language, too, but Iām willing to communicate in it to be part of a much larger language box. I think this can be much more powerful than many separate language islands.
Welcome!
P:S.: There is a French part of the forum: https://community.e.foundation/c/e-en-francais
How can we understand each other and build something if everybody speaks its language ? English looks like the logical choice.
2 Likes
LOL
ā¦
1 Like