Goodbye to Murena & e/OS!

I’m saying goodbye!

It’s been a great four years with e/OS and the dream of a secure and privacy-friendly smartphone. I’ve put up with a lot for it: I bought two completely overpriced Fairphones (4 & 5) and a tablet from Murena, put up with the poor photo quality of these devices, and did without contactless charging, Android Auto, banking and insurance apps. I went to great lengths to live with the many bugs in the individual releases, put up with the inadequate Murena Cloud, and accepted that I would always be behind on security patches and Android versions. As a result, my expensively purchased Fairphone 5 is still running Android 13 today.

Now Murena is increasingly deciding to go mainstream in information technology, even though it won’t survive there anyway! With extensions that hardly anyone wants and ever greater challenges for the already inadequate standard applications.

I’m tired of third-rate hardware, outdated software and doing without digital luxury. That’s why I’m going to take a step back to the dark side of the force: I’m going to buy a flagship smartphone with Google Android that will finally interact with my new car, allow me to keep up with digital progress in finance and healthcare, and fascinate me technically! Something other than the dusty, creaky plastic Fairphones!

Farewell!

Regain your privacy! Adopt /e/OS the deGoogled mobile OS and online servicesphone

2 Likes

If you are going to go the Pixel path, you might as well try GrapheneOS.

2 Likes

Hello @Shakatus ,

sad to see you go - even if I don’t “know” you due to my recent joining. :slightly_frowning_face:

The aspects you mentioned regarding the FairPhones are (and were…) what kept me from buying one of those, they offer few features and a mediocre build for something priced premium.

A truly fair phone would be expensive - but qualitative in all regards. Could even cost 1000 bucks, if it was fair and on quality standards of the modern Google phones (or OnePlus, or Samsung, or …).

Regarding your experiences with Murena and /e/ OS, it is understandable that you feel let down - that some of the actual changes seem like Murena strives for a more mainstream targeted audience.

But on the other hand: features which were missing, not functional (on my devices), not of usable high quality at beginning of 2023, are nowadays on an almost on-par level to LineageOS microG. A lot more works, a lot more shows the striving for quality solutions.

Some features don’t (or are not universally necessary, true) - but the /e/ - and any software - development will always bring some aspects which the users will not applaud for. It is a good aspect that the users can state their experiences and wishes, feelings, demands/requests - and some are considered for coming versions!

/e/ is still behind the actual vendor ROMs for a Google Pixel 9 and other high-end devices, but as well it is not linked in every aspect to server-bound Google services and data fishing / telemetry, third-party services & servers, loads of pre-installed bloatware, which is standard for any “stock” vendor ROM, even on Pixels…
A reason in itself for that I won’t use a stock Google Pixel ROM, ever.

Just as an idea:

You could go the Google Android vendor route with a flagship phone and - maybe in 1-2 years, like I did - check the actual development of /e/ and other alternative OS derivatives.

And maybe you’re surprised how well /e/ developed. Or not. Maybe it doesn’t exist anymore - who knows? I hope it does - and Murena learns from the interests and wishes of their users in terms of “don’t bring MGM as a standard non-uninstallable system application” etc. :fox_face::+1:

I wish you a productive and happy change, in whatever future device / OS you use! :wave:

7 Likes

heresy, betrayal! tar and feather this man!

5 Likes

Well, you have given the phones here, and their os, a good length of time for evaluation and invested in them as well.
I have never had an android phone - I have only had ‘bottom of the range’ iphones, before this one. And I only take ‘snaps’ so, had not really noticed the poor quality of photos. I prefer my eos pixel tablet to the ipad that I used to use, having discovered some great open source apps, including a really good one for pdf editing that someone here recommended to me. So, I think my requirements are so modest that Murena would struggle not to meet them, except on price. If it wasn’t for needing Signal & Protonmail, I could get by with a decent feature phone!
However, like you, I am concerned about developments in eos that (to me) are not completely compatible with an emphasis on privacy and security. Personally, I would prefer just a simple OS with the minimum apps, no cloud, no email - I can choose what services I want to use for myself. Features like Advanced Privacy, I really like. Perhaps they could offer a really good vpn for an extra payment? Just really good security / privacy features!
I don’t think they should try to offer the same features as the other big companies. If people were happy with their offerings, they wouldn’t have moved to Murena, in the first place.

3 Likes

I personnally think that going with /e/OS (Murena) and Fairphone is “only” one of the many steps towards a better common quality of life and better sustainability for this world. To me it’s not only about privacy and independence from Big Tech, it includes having a phone with as many recyclable materials as possible, with as transparent supply/production line as possible. It involves reducing the global cost of our lifestyle: we don’t really need to connect our phones to our car, to take amazing photos all the time, to stream videos everywhere in the world at full speed. At least not in a world with limited resources. But I get you can be disappointed if these things are crucial to you and if you expected Murena to work as efficiently as Big Tech!

6 Likes

This is somewhat offtopic here:
I support that, but as an engineer and developer of quality products, I see “sustainability” not mainly in “recycling”, but in “preventing to have to recycle in the next decade” by using long-term reliable and robust materials, modular systems.

Not five FairPhones in just a few years, but maybe one new model all six to eight years. Focus on the best solution from beginning and on long-term lasting quality & support. That’s sustainable. To develop new devices all few years is the opposite of sustainable. It is a way to maximize profit by bringing people into thinking: “Oh, something new, let’s buy that, it must be better!”.

In terms of their build quality FairPhones leave quite a bit of room for improvements. And that’s something where I don’t see the premium prices as a fair base for a “fair phone” in total.

A “fair phone” for sustainability would - IMHO - have the highest quality materials for longest usage, long lasting and reliable construction.

Even if a long-lasting and high-end product would then cost 1200 or 1400€ / $, I would support it, if I feel, see and hear about the quality (due to less reports regarding failing or creaking, cheap hardware). If the focus is on one model and that one gets the best for longest sustainability, that’s great. But to have X FairPhone models in just a few years… that’s the opposite of sustainable.

2 Likes

You probably don’t have anything to hide, don’t you?

1 Like

Of course, I was forgetting the repairability aspect. I am hoping to keep my phone for many years. If I look after it, I should only need new batteries periodically. I found a great protective case on Amazon, a Tudia, which is better than the standard one.
But, if people want high end features and state of the art functionality, possibly this is not the best phone / system for them. But, I don’t need those things.

I’m not sure which user you aim this response at? :thinking:

It’s not a response to anyone, so it’s a comment to the OP’s idea to go back to Google.

2 Likes

if you leave e/OS use at least one alternative and install it yourself

https://download.lineage.microg.org/

Sorry to hear that.
Yeah, I understand that everybody has different situation with likes and dislikes in different way… What can I say here when I can’t even convince my GF to use degoogled phone lol (though I can’t get upset at her).
I still appreciate them for what they are doing even though some of the stuff is sounding controversial (or unclear at this moment).
Anyways, whatever the choice you make, goodluck to you and wish you success!

We are asking for that since years,
Please @GaelDuval and /e/ team,

make all apps choosable at first install !

6 Likes

As an average user who installed e/os via the easy installer on my FP5 purchased from the Fairphone website, this is what I expected. An OS that offers choice, imposes nothing, is transparent, and configurable as desired.
In the end, I have an OS full of imposed, rather bad apps (Mail doesn’t work, the browser is slow, doesn’t offer a translator, Gallery is seriously lacking in fairly basic options, etc.).
While the proposed apps are bad, they’re free, so it’s hard to complain. But having them imposed on me, especially in an interface that requires keeping them on its own page, without an app drawer, is inconsistent and frustrating.
I end up with duplicate apps.

And to top it all off, a 3.0 update full of new features that are completely useless to me and, I think, to most people. I haven’t been a user for a long time and I already regret switching to this OS.

If by this you mean make all app separately installable or uninstallable I think it was answered some time back. We did put in some efforts to achieve this but had to give up as it required complicated development activity. Neither did we have the resources not the time to invest in the activity and regrettably had to give it up.

2 Likes

I prefer a list of installed (system) apps in App Lounge where you have the option to uninstall them (and reinstall them when necessary).

3 Likes

I don’t believe that enable the ability to uninstall system app would require that much development. In fact, i believe it requires more to try to prevent the user to do so.
“Choose freedom” is your slogan. Where’s freedom of choice ? I couldn’t even uninstall MDM on my phone when it was present !!

Understandable, while there’s probably one problem through the “connection” in /e/:

The “Account manager” system application can change and setup many configurations of different applications, even the system itself, to a degree where it will reset a changed configuration (as example in the mail client) forcibly again and again, if its “task” is not disabled.

Which could lead to a bunch of problems, if those configurations and applications are no longer here, but the /e/ specific system applications try to setup or modify them.

(I found that out as I fixed the mail client configuration problematic… it is not really a problem / bug of the mail client, it is one of the Account manager.)

So it could at the end resemble, that to choose to uninstall several applications, a whole bunch of connected applications might either stop working reliably or have to be uninstalled, as well.

And /e/ without Account manager, the security solutions based on TOR, tracker removal and co., the sync-enabled replacement of specific standard applications (notes, as example) - is more or less comparable to LineageOS microG, isn’t it?

So if one doesn’t want to have application X, Y and Z, which could mean that applications A, B and C would as well stop working reliably (and as such would get removed at the time one selects to uninstall X, Y and Z to reduce potential problems), what’s left of /e/?

That’s why I have the feeling, /e/ with free choice over any system standard applications (as adb gives, in freedom), would not go parallel with what Murena wants to offer to the market.

Which is no slightly different LineageOS microG with only core functionality, but a package optimized to be able to sync all (replaced) standard apps to several different platform accounts which can be inserted in Account manager.

As such: an OS which offers easy setup for organizational and business, as well as private “all in one” solutions. Not “just core functionality” solutions, there are other OSes for this.


Another example: App store solution. Murena’s solution is a standardized, integrated store solution which can download from Google Play store servers, as well as from F-Droid servers (and probably some open source platforms, which I didn’t find more specified yet).

People now have some problem with the anonymous login or any other feature of it.

In the forum they recommend: Install F-Droid separately. Install Aurora Store separately.
Well, that works - then you have access to both sources of stores individually. But: that as well works with any other Android derivation. And same as good.

That’s probably not what Murena wants to offer with /e/: their “all in one, centralized management” solution to be waved aside and ignoring its combined core functionalities by installing individual management solutions (like F-Droid, Aurora Store) instead of using the access to both (all) in their own app store.

I guess if someone wants that, doesn’t want to use the centralized account management, another OS is the more “basic functionality” solution.
Even as /e/ can be used without accounts, but that works with any standard application of LineageOS microG as well, it works with separate F-Droid installations, separate Aurora Store installations, separate… well, almost everything.

No need for /e/, then, if one wants to skip using the core system functionalities which Murena developed for /e/ and which prove the biggest difference visible for me towards the alternatives.

Murena presents it as functional on the centralized syncing solutions, on a set of applications which can be used by just one account, more or less.
(Which doesn’t work 100% right now, as we all know, but maybe it improves.)

Or, to do a less “TL;DR” variant:

I feel like many users misunderstand the “Your data is YOUR data!”.
From what I see on my own now-/e/ device and what Murena publishes, establishes, integrates…

It doesn’t mean that “Your data is YOUR data, as your system is wholly built around what you want to have on it!”.

It more or less means: “Your data is YOUR data, because you can technically use your accounts (data) synced and available on your device from several platforms like Murena, Google, … - with no effort at all, or you can leave it on the device and not use accounts to sync it”.

/e/ doesn’t seem like a minimalist system where you can remove everything you don’t need easily on first boot-up or installation routine. It seems like something you can set up to 75-90% by syncing everything with one account, be it Google (working again, if I’m right) or Murena, or … - and the applications will automatically offer you to access your data on those accounts synced. :man_shrugging:

This all with a focus on security and less data off-shored towards big tech companies, less telemetry, bloatware… but not a system where everything is removed, as this would go contrary to the “enter one account and have most of your necessary hubs / data centralized and synced” feature.